Favoriting Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from November 23, 2020 Favoriting

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Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. Tech, community, video games, and whatever else is next.

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Favoriting November 23, 2020: Gizmodo's Shoshana Wodinsky on Spotify

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Tonight: Gizmodo's Shoshana Wodinsky

Spotify is following the playbook of Facebook and Google to become the next Big Tech monopoly. What is Spotify doing with our data?

Links to Shoshana Wodinsky:

About Shoshana Wodinsky, staff reporter at Gizmodo covering consumer privacy and tech policy

• On Twitter: @swodinsky

Spotify's Latest Acquisition Is All About Your Data (by Wodinsky in Gizmodo, Nov 10, 2020): "The Megaphone acquisition clarifies how to think about Spotify overall: It's quickly becoming an advertising behemoth - less the Netflix of audio and much more akin to Facebook or Google for your ears."

Spotify's Weird LinkedIn Playlists Sound Like a Cash Register (by Wodinsky in Gizmodo, March 5, 2020): "Spotify has slowly morphed its playlists into data-mining machines. . . . I'm giving the company not only my emotional state but also my entire schedule."

Your Weather App Is Selling You Out (by Wodinsky in Gizmodo, Sep 14, 2020): "It's not just about tracking the weather, but tracking the way it's impacting our collective moods as a whole."

Please Keep Mark Zuckerberg Away From My Bones (by Wodinsky in Gizmodo, Aug 18, 2020), which prompted me to write Facebook and your bones (Aug 20).

More Gizmodo articles by Shoshana



Other pointers:

A Tale Of Two Ecosystems: On Bandcamp, Spotify And The Wide-Open Future (Damon Krukowski on NPR, Aug 19, 2020): "Spotify's royalty rates are so low that to earn a living wage of $15 an hour, a musician needs 657,895 streams per month . . . The differences are so extreme, Bandcamp may not just be the anti-Spotify; it may be operating in an entirely different world."

...and from the November 2 show with Bill Deresiewicz, author of "The Death of the Artist":

Spotify Celebrates 100th Dollar Given To Artists (The Onion, Sep 3, 2020): "Spotify CEO Daniel Ek, posing with a giant check for a $0.00000029 payout that propelled the world's musicians past a collective $100 in earnings. 'This is an absolute milestone for a musician-oriented platform like Spotify, and confirms what we believed when we started, which is that music-streaming platforms can be a reliable way to help bands and artists earn pennies or even nickels for their work. But this achievement is really about the artists on our platform. Spotify couldn't have done it without you.'"

Spotify to offer artists and labels the option to promote their music in your recommendations (The Fader, Nov 2, 2020): "In exchange for a lowered 'promotional recording royalty rate.'"

The Pocket Gods - 100mostXcellent30: an album of 100 30-second songs

- - -

PAST EPISODES: techtonic.fm lists recent Techtonic interviews and Little Slice of Tech Pie segments.

PODCAST: Subscribe to the Techtonic podcast

Artist Track Album Images Approx. start time
  Gizmodo's Shoshana Wodinsky discusses Spotify, and what it's doing with our data.
Tomaš Dvořák  Game Boy Tune   Favoriting Machinarium Soundtrack 
Favoriting
0:00:27 (Pop-up)
  Mark's intro    
Favoriting
0:01:07 (Pop-up)
  Interview with Shoshana Wodinsky    
Favoriting
0:11:40 (Pop-up)
  Mark's comments after the interview    
Favoriting
0:43:41 (Pop-up)
The Pocket Gods  We're All No Hit Wonders Now   Favoriting 100mostXcellent30    0:53:38 (Pop-up)
The Pocket Gods  YouTube Is Fleecing You   Favoriting 100mostXcellent30    0:54:05 (Pop-up)
The Pocket Gods  Nobody Makes Money Any More   Favoriting 100mostXcellent30    0:54:50 (Pop-up)
Negativland  More Data   Favoriting The World Will Decide 
Favoriting
0:57:05 (Pop-up)


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Listener comments!

  6:00pm
David in London:

Evening Technoids.
Hi Mark.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:01pm
ultradamno:

Mark! Techtermatologists!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:03pm
Webhamster Henry:

Hi Mark and friends!
  6:04pm
David in London:

Ultradamno, high five.
Webhamster, yo.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:04pm
Fuzzy:

Hola technoamigos!
That Philip Michaels tweet is great!
Avatar 🤖 6:04pm
Bas NL:

Hi Mark! Bigtechtonic lovers!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:04pm
Webhamster Henry:

You have to mention this Spotify Onion article: www.theonion.com...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:05pm
Ignatatus666:

I wish we could share this program much easier
I wish I could have it play on my FB homepage the way we were able to do on MySpace in the past.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:05pm
ultradamno:

Hiya DiL!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:06pm
Ignatatus666:

What’s up Tonic Teckies
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:06pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Looking forward to this show today. I'm on a anti-Spotify rampage!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:06pm
spodiodi:

hi Mark Hurst and everyone
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:07pm
spodiodi:

i've never used it
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:07pm
Handy Haversack:

Mark and the Techyons! Sorry we're late. Had to feed the neighbors' cat.

ultradamno, David, hello!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:07pm
ultradamno:

Hey Handy!
  6:07pm
Dan Cashin:

Everyone leave FB for the open-source option- I think it's out there but not off the ground ????
  6:07pm
David in London:

Hey a Spod.
  6:08pm
David in London:

The Wisdom of Solomon. And I should know...
Hey Handy.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:09pm
melinda:

hi all!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:09pm
ultradamno:

He'd be the ZZ Top member that makes them too creeped out to finish playing Legs.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:11pm
Ignatatus666:

@Dan
Many of my friends are weaning off FB and going to Parler and another site.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:11pm
listener james from westwood:

Evening, Mark and all!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:12pm
spodiodi:

hi David, Handy, ultrad, Bas, Fuzzy, tim, Webhamster Henry, Melinda, Dan, 666, james!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:12pm
ultradamno:

Hi Spodi!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:12pm
Mark Hurst:

Hi, everyone! @Webham, good pick - that article is already on the playlist at left :)
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:12pm
ultradamno:

Is Tidal still a thing?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:15pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Yeah, that dude with the beard. If he showed up to a ZZ Top practice. They'd send him out to pick up barbecue in the next town which just happened to be 400 miles away.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:16pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

Good evening, Mark, Good evening, spodifi.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:17pm
Mark Hurst:

Hi Ken! And Tim, Spodi, ultra, James,Igna,Melinda, DiL,Dan, Handy,Bas,Webham!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:17pm
Webhamster Henry:

I'm a bandcamper - my son has about 24 albums on there too!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:20pm
Ignatatus666:

That’s great Henry
I love how they have specials where all the money goes to the Artists.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:20pm
spodiodi:

hi KenFHP!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:20pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Spotify has more than music?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:20pm
ultradamno:

I like chunky jazz for the commute
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:23pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

In last week's show, one of the people the authors of the Silcon Valley book interviewed a Storyteller. What is a Story Teller?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:23pm
Webhamster Henry:

Last time I had a job that paid me a salary, it was for a company that used Spotify playlists combined with live voiceover to make a kind of radio station. I wasn't too happy with their API, and also, of course, you had to have a premium account to be able to play things you wanted to hear.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:25pm
Mark Hurst:

@Tim I think it's a glorified title for what used to be called a PR manager, or perhaps a "marketing communications" person.
  6:25pm
Dean:

@tim from champaign (now washington): iirc, the person did PR for a SV company, i.e., s/he framed the company in terms of stories, narratives that promote the company's profile.
  6:26pm
Dean:

There you go^
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:27pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Thanks, Mark and Dean.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:29pm
Webhamster Henry:

... The good thing was I'd use my own band's music as some of music to play for testing purposes.
  6:31pm
Dean:

Way back in 2006, old fashioned English professor Richard Lanham published The Economics of Attention: Style and Substance in the Age of Information. He's been writing about this sort of thing for ages. Not super techie, but good background from the Humanities.
https://press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/468828.html
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:32pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

At the risk of sounding like a snob, it seems like spotify is a platform for people who don't really like music but want it on as a background.
  6:33pm
David in London:

Not ‘false data as a prelude to channel shift’ shocker!
Vinyl is dead. Remember that everyone. Oh, hang on a minute...
  6:33pm
Earthwalker:

Dump Goggle
Go DuckDuckGo !
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:33pm
Mark Hurst:

@ultra good name for us
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:33pm
Mark Hurst:

@Bas I also liked "Bigtechtonic lovers"
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:34pm
Mark Hurst:

@Tim do a DuckDuckGo search for Kyle Chayka (recent Techtonic guest) writing last week about how *Netflix* seems to be creating intentionally mediocre shows that just serve, essentially, as video wallpaper
  6:35pm
David in London:

“It’s creepy and I don’t like it.”
A catchphrase for the age. Can we have that on the Techtonic 2021 Marathon Premium t-shirt please Mark?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:36pm
Mark Hurst:

@DiL good idea. Just need a good graphic to go along with it.............!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:36pm
Handy Haversack:

Which, Mark, seems like an extension of the *decades*-long antilabor move of capital. If you can pay workers less, make a crappier product, but then also commodify the customers? You have won capitalism.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:36pm
melinda:

someone meowed
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:36pm
Handy Haversack:

Not the first meow of the interview!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:36pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Hmmm, I'd like to make of playlist on some of my favorites on Spotify: Flipper, The Germs, Drunks With Guns, Throbbing Gristle, etc to see who my profile gets sold to. Hopefully, a cash only sketchy liquor store.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:37pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

I'll check that out Mark.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:37pm
Mark Hurst:

@Handy I think that's fair... the question that keeps coming up on the show is "is it new"... which gets into semantics, whether this is actually a new form of capitalism or just a gradual evolution of what came before.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:37pm
Mark Hurst:

(past guests have argued both sides.)
  6:38pm
Dean:

I recall a graphic-free t-shirt, c.1990, that read simply:

I saw! I know! You disgust me.
  6:38pm
David in London:

Tim. Drunks With Guns will always be a radio friendly unit shifter...
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:38pm
ultradamno:

I think this is a more reasonable implant than Citrix's www.pinterest.com...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:38pm
spodiodi:

lol Dean. nice
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:40pm
ultradamno:

Don't forget The Mentors and GG!
  6:40pm
Dean:

Happy Flowers
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:41pm
ultradamno:

SOLGER!
  6:41pm
David in London:

A Flux of Pink Indians.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:42pm
Handy Haversack:

I hear you, Mark. And I think that one issue also is, well, phones. I mean, I don't use one, as you know, and I never see an ad. Not that I'm not sold as much as anyone else, but my internet experience is completely ad-free. I assume that is not possible when one is using FB or IG or Twitter apps on a phone? If 100 percent of people just blocked all ads -- and refused to traffic sites (like many newspapers) that demand that you turn off ad blockers, would we ... win?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:42pm
ultradamno:

Blight, Kilslug...I'm loving this playlist.
  6:42pm
Earthwalker:

Capitalism money in the hands of the few
Drop Facebook
Boycott amazon
  6:43pm
David in London:

Controlled Bleeding.

Hey Earth Walker.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:43pm
Niall:

This is pretty intense; I think I didn't get to listen to it much back when I lived stateside, but it squares nicely with my politics and similar programs on Resonance FM in London.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:44pm
Niall:

Thanks for this show, @Mark Hurst.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:44pm
spodiodi:

thanks, Shoshana Wodinsky nice interview, Mark
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:46pm
ultradamno:

I have found Dark Sky is unbeatable for telling you the weather just as it's happening, before...what are they, psychic?
  6:46pm
Dean:

NON (early)
Unsustainable Social Condition
SPK (early)
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:46pm
Webhamster Henry:

I can't wait until 23AndMe is mined for selling drugs to people with genetic charateristics that haven't manifested yet.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:46pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Good interview. I liked hearing the agreement and disagreement between Shoshana and Mark.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:46pm
ultradamno:

UNS! NO! Mars!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:47pm
ultradamno:

Boy Dirt Car
  6:47pm
Dean:

Blurt
  6:47pm
Earthwalker:

Yo David
What’s up Bro
12:44 French Time I’m being summoned by the wife
I’m history
Be well all !
Om Shanti
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:47pm
Fuzzy:

Dark Sky was great until Apple bought it up and I couldn't use it on my Android phone anymore.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:48pm
ultradamno:

I saw SPK, not so early open for Chris & Cosey, their dancing girls tore it up.
  6:48pm
Dean:

Saw SPK early at Al's Bar. Opening act was ... Nervous Gender? Monitor?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:49pm
Niall:

What am I missing with the industrial/noise acts getting mentioned here, me too me too me too.

I used to live not far from Long Island and I'd occasionally meet people who said that Paul Lemos/Controlled Bleeding was their teacher in the past.
  6:49pm
Dean:

Saw NON at Kelbo's. Whew.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:50pm
Handy Haversack:

Yay, Bandcamp!

I have to serve dinner, but thanks, Mark -- and thanks, Shoshana! Very good stuff.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:51pm
Ignatatus666:

The more I share DuckDucks posts on FB the more FB puts restrictions on my account.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:51pm
ultradamno:

Manon Anne Gilles and her musical wheelchair vimeo.com...
  6:52pm
Dmitry:

the moment bandcamp allows users to make playlists ill get off spotify. Any idea why they havent done so yet?
  6:52pm
David in London:

Carcass.
Man, can’t believe how quickly this hour flashed by.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:52pm
Webhamster Henry:

On one hand, Spotify is not the only place people can get digital music distributed, on the other hand, it is clearly the biggest fish. Outside of Youtube that is.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:53pm
Niall:

Bandcamp's such a friggin' frustration from a user experience, blarg. Not that it stops me spending a lot of money there.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:53pm
Webhamster Henry:

There are Spotify equivalents of click farms.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:54pm
ultradamno:

Industrial/noise? I thought we were building a scuzz/sludge playlist
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:55pm
Ignatatus666:

@Niall I totally agree!! It’s difficult to use

30 second songs covers many DRI songs
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:55pm
Niall:

Ha, this sounds like stole that KLF book, got bored and just put down whatever.

Sorry, ultradamno, I came the party late, I guess.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:55pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

@Webhamster - I was wondering about that. I'd imagine musicians who want to to "make it big" would try to juke the plays somehow.
  6:55pm
David in London:

Ultradamno, I assumed it was just generally anti social sounds that would irritate the eardrums.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Webhamster Henry:

... with a 30 second track, you can pack more of them per hour!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
ultradamno:

Tomata, tomatuh
  6:56pm
Dmitry:

I'm only on spotify to get off of youtube to begin with. There needs to be an ethical alternative before users will leave. Im sure theres a large enough constituency for this, especially after the demonstrable (if minor) success of bandcamp fridays. Does anyone have an idea if anything further is possible on bandcamp in this direction ?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Niall:

@Mark Hurst, have you heard the... "Guy Who Sings Songs About Cities and Towns?" I think that's what he calls himself. Thousands of songs on Spotify, just some catchy chords, very dubious vocals and lyrics apparently gleaned from Wikipedia. He's great.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
spodiodi:

thanks, Mark!
thanks, Scott!
  6:56pm
David in London:

Thanks Mark. Later Technoids.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Niall:

I mean he has songs about Newburgh.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:57pm
tim from champaign (now washington):

Thanks, Mark. An interesting and informative show as always!
  6:57pm
Dmitry:

Thanks all!
Avatar 🤖 6:57pm
Bas NL:

Thanks Mark!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
Webhamster Henry:

@Niale that the passionate and objective Jokerfan , often heard on Ken's show.
music.apple.com...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
Mark Hurst:

Thanks, everyone! Have a happy & safe Thanksgiving, for those of us in the US.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
ultradamno:

New Negativland, new Cabaret Voltaire...
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:59pm
ultradamno:

Can we hope for a Maybe Mental or Psyclones comeback?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:59pm
Webhamster Henry:

People Like Us is filling in for Trouble on Thursday, in station fill-in news.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 7:00pm
spodiodi:

PLU ftw
Avatar Swag For Life Member 7:00pm
Mark Hurst:

There was a brief quote by Shoshana Zuboff there
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 7:01pm
ultradamno:

Nate filling in for efd too
Avatar 12:13am
ARB:

Do you have a suggestion for a weather app that doesn't track?
  2:49pm
Db Dan:

@Ignatatus666
In regards to Parler (to "peak" in French) I glanced at at their site. Their privacy policy was very long (not a good sign) and one sentence in it says "We process and store your information in the U.S. We do not sell your information to third parties or share your information with foreign governments except in the limited circumstances described in this Privacy Policy". Concerning bits are ..... They "store" the information ........ If you join, we may "verify your identity, such as a copy of your government-issued photo identification, and information that can be used to facilitate the redemption of virtual items or payments, such as your Social Security number (SSN) or your tax identification number." It's a tricky world, but I'll wait on social media via Parler. Thanks for the tip to check them out in any case. Go Technoids!
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