Options Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from May 13, 2019 Options

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Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. Tech, community, video games, and whatever else is next.

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Options May 13, 2019: Shoshana Zuboff, author, "The Age of Surveillance Capitalism"

Listen to this show: MP3 - 128K |  Pop‑up player! | Add or read comments

This week: Shoshana Zuboff, author, "The Age of Surveillance Capitalism: The Fight for a Human Future at the New Frontier of Power"



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Pointers:

• Shoshana Zuboff on Twitter: @shoshanazuboff - author of The Age of Surveillance Capitalism and professor emerita of Harvard Business School. She was one of the first tenured female professors at HBS.



Source:
Matt Stoller, May 13


Google CEO Sundar Pichai's NYT op-ed (May 7): "To make privacy real, we give you clear, meaningful choices around your data. All while staying true to two unequivocal policies: that Google will never sell any personal information to third parties; and that you get to decide how your information is used. . . . a small subset of data helps serve ads that are relevant and that provide the revenue that keeps Google products free and accessible. [Mark notes: this is the data necessary for service improvement and largely irrelevant to Google's surveillance-and-control model.] That revenue also sustains a broad community of content creators, which in turn helps keep content on the web free for everyone. [Mark notes: just like flat-earth YouTubers!]"



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Check out techtonic.fm for recent Techtonic interviews and Little Slice of Tech Pie segments.

PODCAST: Subscribe to the Techtonic podcast

Artist Track Album Label Images Approx. start time
  Shoshana Zuboff's new book "The Age of Surveillance Capitalism" describes why Google, Facebook, and other Big Tech companies are so obsessed with spying on every moment of your life. Surveillance is only part of the agenda: what they're really building is a system of predicting and controlling your behavior.
Tomaš Dvořák  Game Boy Tune   Options Machinarium Soundtrack  No label 
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  Mark's intro      
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  Interview with Shoshana Zuboff, Part 1      
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0:14:44 (MP3 | Pop‑up)
  Interview with Shoshana Zuboff, Part 2      
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0:35:08 (MP3 | Pop‑up)
Red Rockers  China   Options Good as Gold  Columbia 
Options
0:53:45 (MP3 | Pop‑up)

Listener comments!

Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 5:57pm listener james from westwood:

Looks like a healthy-sized book! Which I guess bodes ill for escaping surveillance capitalism.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:02pm ultradamno:

Hello Mark, techronitors!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:02pm queems:

howdy
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:03pm Ike:

Greetings, humans, cats, dogs, aardvarks, and streetside wi-fi cameras!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:03pm annie:

yep!!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:04pm Phillippe Bastille:

Hey all.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:04pm Greg from ZONE 5:

Evening, Mark and all!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:04pm chresti:

Hi Mark and Techtonians
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:04pm Webhamster Henry:

Welcome T3kt0n1k1575!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:04pm Bas NL:

Hi Mark!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:05pm Ken From Hyde Park:

Hi, Mark and technopeepers!
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:06pm melinda:

Hi Techron’s
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:07pm melinda:

Techtons, not Techrons
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:08pm Beast of Boonton:

Techtonic: The rise and fall of social media
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:08pm Fuzzy:

A New World Odor -- cue up the Ministry!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:10pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

One of the 1st things I ever knew about Zuck: him saying 'Privacy is overrated.'
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:10pm ultradamno:

When he said the future is private are we sure he didn't mean it's none of our business?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:10pm Ken From Hyde Park:

@Fuzzy - "We're not about to make that same mistake twice."
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:11pm paul b:

Yes! I already own this book, and second the recommendation and coverage of it. To be sure (as your photo indicates) it is a big book.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:11pm annie:

just found a ralph nader show covering this; from january
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 6:11pm TDK60:

Hello.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:14pm Ken From Hyde Park:

Just logged into the library system to request a copy of the book. I am one of sixteen on the list.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:15pm Greg from ZONE 5:

Aww, a co-worker currently has her art up on those things. I'm not gonna tell her they're spying on us.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:16pm Folsom:

@Greg why not?
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:16pm queems:

yeah that's too many
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 6:16pm TDK60:

..back in the '90s there was a NYC street theater group that protested at surveillance camera sites.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:18pm ultradamno:

"Is he insane? Facebook will hear him": www.theonion.com...
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:18pm queems:

cool, i'm ready for my panic attack
  Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:18pm gdebord:

Imagine some of those 30 sensors being experimental olfactory sensors. Try hiding from the sniffing surveillance towers! Data profiles that include your scents and pheromones. No good.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:18pm chresti:

They're harvesting data for AI?
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:19pm Folsom:

Mark, any word from Michael Chertoff?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:21pm Mark Hurst:

Hi everyone! Thanks for joining on the accu this evening.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:21pm Mark Hurst:

@Folsom, unfortunately, no.. I tried!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:23pm Ken From Hyde Park:

How did movie night turn out? I wasn't able to make it this year.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:23pm listener james from westwood:

Oh, jeez, remember the "behavioral futures market" they wanted to start during GWB/Iraq II?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:23pm Mark Hurst:

Went well, good group & good Q&A afterward!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:27pm Beast of Boonton:

Why is she whistling?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:27pm Mark Hurst:

Skype compression artifacts, unfortunately
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:29pm Webhamster Henry:

Skype is owned by Microsoft! Use Appear.in or zoom.us!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:29pm Mark Hurst:

True
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:29pm coelacanth∅:

hello Mark & all
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:33pm Beast of Boonton:

skype sux too
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:33pm annie:

it pisses me off that youtube is owned by google..YT is is becoming such a mess of terrible selections, even just in the last few weeks.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:34pm annie:

thanks Webhamster, i'm going to try those two..
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:35pm Webhamster Henry:

YT's suggestions and related videos and search have been embarrassing for its entire existence.
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:37pm Johnzon:

at first I thought she was saying shadow tax... made just as much sense. giving up our information/privacy is a tax we pay for the "service"
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:39pm Mark Hurst:

"Shadow text"
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:39pm Webhamster Henry:

Fb & Google could do "tarot readings" based on their idea of you based on your data correlated with models built out of everyone else's data.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:41pm chresti:

They can have gypsy wagons at carnivals@Web Henry
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:44pm annie:

yeah, henry, it's such a joke..i know what i want to see and
they continuously sidestep my searches..
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:44pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

The Digital realm jumped the Bill of Rights.
We don't own ourselves.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:45pm annie:

exactly RR
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:47pm Linda Lee:

wouldn't you know it ~ postmodern totalitarianism is just about profit. evil becomes ever more banal!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:48pm annie:

even though DD Go is annoying, i've been suggesting changes they can make to keep me from adding the G back to my search engine selections.
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:48pm fullmetalmonkey:

Wow this is a good interview. I could listen to her talk for hours. Great Show.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:48pm Linda Lee:

we own ourselves only inasfar as we don't require commerce. we often don't.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:49pm Mark Hurst:

Thanks, fullmetalmonkey! She was great to speak with. Highly recommend reading her book.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:49pm chresti:

I'm imagining a recorded conversations in cars bank.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:50pm annie:

thank you SO much mark!...
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:51pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

@LL: I don't throw a dime - but facebook owns content & enables my community...
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:51pm Linda Lee:

we'll be saved by re-discovering our own imagination. watch!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:51pm annie:

yess!!! ^^^
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:51pm Webhamster Henry:

Hi folks! There's even more data that can be picked up - while navigating a website, some activity monitors track your mouse moves as well as clicks to make heat maps of what parts of the site are "attractive" and how long it takes to get to that "call to action" (a button to do something like buy something).
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:52pm Linda Lee:

yuh .. but i also know real people who don't use fb. so we can definitely do without that. if you & i wish to communicate outside the platform, we can.
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:53pm fullmetalmonkey:

I'm definitely buying this book. Totally fascinating.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:53pm Linda Lee:

imagination! see?
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:54pm coelacanth∅:

i'd put money,Lots of money (so i make more on the bet) on internet suppliers gathering data also (ie optimum)
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:54pm annie:

i'm thinking of this huge Bernie rally here in asheville this friday..so much FB is being used to bring people in.
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:55pm Snoochienucci:

Great show as always! I will be grabbing that book asap
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:56pm Webhamster Henry:

There's that Fb "profile device" that moves around watching you like a Twonky.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:56pm annie:

i'm going to listen to the ralph nader interview, too
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm Folsom:

@annie I can't figure out why bands and stores uses FB to organize shows, meetings, sales, etc. In the past you would go to their website, now they offload everything FB.
  Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm Sam:

Wow Mark, Killer show!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm Bas NL:

Thanks Mark!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm coelacanth∅:

Thanks Mark Thanks Shoshana!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm Webhamster Henry:

That is "the Portal"!
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm dale:

a flat earther group is funding a huge antenna array at wbcq in monticello maine.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:57pm coelacanth∅:

(and read "1984")
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm chresti:

Thanks Mark!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm Phillippe Bastille:

Thanks Mark
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm ultradamno:

I remember them from when they sounded a lot more like The Clash.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm annie:

wow,dale
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm melinda:

Great show, I'll definitely watch the flat earther doc.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:58pm ultradamno:

"Guns of Revolution" was their big song then.
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 6:59pm dale:

soon shortwave will be filled with more brother stair and flat earth chatter.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 6:59pm chresti:

We'll see how China goes...
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 6:59pm annie:

SW will alwaysbe evolving
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 7:00pm Linda Lee:

late to the party, Mark, but i'll be back! thanks for speaking with Ms Zuboff!
  Mon. 5/13/19 7:00pm Sam:

Everybody on this comments board is now on Google’s enemies list, by the way.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 7:00pm Linda Lee:

we'll see if permitted!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 7:00pm Webhamster Henry:

@Folsom Fb is where the people are!

The means for a company to reach customers is always shifting around. Newspapers that everyone read, radio and tv that everyone listened to and watched, email, social media, and now messaging and home appliances. I'm surprised Alexa et al don't just throw ads at you randomly all day like websites and apps do that you've foolishly allow to notify you "occasionally".
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 7:01pm chresti:

Right!
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 7:01pm dale:

went to get a new dumb phone ysterday and i was informed verizon's network wouldn't be supporting them much longer. had to go android.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 7:01pm Mark Hurst:

Thanks, everyone - let's keep the conversation going. See you next week.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 5/13/19 7:02pm Webhamster Henry:

I guess I'll have to get that book!
She's really on point!
Thanks!
  Mon. 5/13/19 7:02pm Sam:

Alexa is still new so they can’t make it annoying yet. Once everyone has one and you can’t live without it, the ads will start.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 7:02pm chresti:

dale, do you have a scanner?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 7:03pm Ken From Hyde Park:

There will someday be a Facebook equivalent for pets. Why would they not try that?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 5/13/19 7:04pm Fuzzy:

Degoogled Android = LineageOS
Avatar Mon. 5/13/19 7:04pm dale:

chresti - not other than an hp printer/scanner/fax
Avatar Swag For Life Member Thu. 5/23/19 5:17am jamesie:

Shoshana signed my copy at the ICA in London. I am writing my theses for MFA Computational Art on surveillance. Truly the right person at the right time. Let's hope her work is not left in the bargain bins in 2 years time when the obsession wears off.
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