Options Scott Williams: Playlist from December 21, 2015 Options

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" I can't tell when you're telling me the truth."
- I'm not.
"How do I know anything you've told me is..."
- You don't.

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Options December 21, 2015: We can laugh now

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Artist Track Album Label Year Comments Approx. start time
Gonçalo F Cardoso & Ruben Pater  The Life and Death of a 21st Century Drone Machine (excerpt)   Options A Study Into 21st Century Drone Acoustics  Discrepant       
John Duncan  Riverrun   Options V/a, Swedish Energies V  Swedish Energies      0:11:17 ()
Runaway Train    Runaway Train  Ash International    March 9, 1948, New Brunswick Canada - recording b/t a driver on a runaway train and his controller. Thanks Bryce for alerting me to this!  0:16:17 ()
Dylan Golden Aycock  Rise and Shine   Options Rise & Shine  Scissor Tail Editions      0:39:32 ()
Alice Coltrane  Hare Krishna   Options Universal Consciousness        0:50:51 ()
E-Musikgruppe Lux Ohr  Jenseits der Mauer des Schlafes   Options Split LP w. Hisko Detria  Svart      0:59:07 ()
Roger Miller  We Grind Open (In)   Options Oh. Guitars, etc.  Feeding Tube  1988    1:17:26 ()
Volcano the Bear  Go Fetch The Water Anthony / Tubular Smells / BB / Pretty Flower / Fog Slicer   Options Commencing (box set)  Miasmah    Jeeeezus, wow... beautiful box! check out Aaron Moore's guest spot on Fabio's show last week  1:22:39 ()
I Know I'm An Alien  Chariots of Fire   Options I know Im An Alien And I Want To Go Home Sometimes But Then I Remember That I Gotta Try And Understand You  no label      1:35:52 ()
Krootchey  Qu'est-ce Qu'il A (D'plus que moi ce negro la?)   Options V/a, France Chebran: French Boogie 1981-1985  Born Bad      1:46:55 ()
LB  Ashes to Ashes   Options Pop Artificielle        1:51:15 ()
Space Project  Conquest of the Stars   Options Special Disco Mix 12" 45RPM  RCA  1977    1:55:52 ()
Suicide  Keep Your Dreams   Options S/t (reissue only)        2:03:39 ()
Ramleh  Liberty Bell   Options Circular Time  Crucial Blast      2:06:45 ()
The Rotary Connection  Burning of the Midnight Lamp   Options Songs    1969  cover: Jimi Hendrix  2:13:12 ()
Sun Ra and HIs Intergalactic Infinity Arkestra  Love In Outer Space (vocal)   Options To Those of Earth...And Other Worlds  Strut      2:17:42 ()
Mamman Sani Abdoulaye  Gosi   Options Unreleased Tapes 1981-1984  Sahel Sounds      2:21:26 ()
Mario Nascimbene  Carol On The Sea   Options V/a, Library of Sound Grooves: Jazz Expressions from the Italian Cinema (1963-1975)  Semi-Automatic    with Korton  2:27:34 ()
Ruth White  Asturias   Options Short Circuits        2:35:47 ()
Unknown  Untitled   Options Unknown  Lost Treasures of the Underworld      2:41:13 ()
Josephine Foster  My Dove, My Beautiful One   Options No More Lamps In the Morning  Fire      2:46:28 ()
Julian Cope  Don't Call Me Mark Chapman   Options Autogeddon  American      2:50:34 ()

Listener comments!

Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:03pm Ken From Hyde Park:

Laugh at what, now?
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:04pm Scott Williams:

how about Jim Price? Hi Ken!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:06pm Cecile:

hi, all! I just heard Hotline Bling. The parodies are 70000 times better than the actual song. I rarely say this, but this makes me want to go into the music business.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:06pm Greg from ZONE 5:

Oi Scott! Sorry I missed you last night, buddy. I got home, put my pjs on, made food and THEN remembered that you were up the street.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:07pm joe mulligan:

love these drone tones Scott!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:08pm Scott Williams:

no worries Greg! the image of you preparing latenite foodies in your jammies makes up for all
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:08pm Scott Williams:

Hey Joe M, thanks!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:08pm V Priceless:

Heya Scott and all!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:09pm Scott Williams:

Yo V!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:09pm steve:

Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:10pm Scott Williams:

@steve, heyYO!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:10pm Cecile:

Although I discovered this, which, as the kids says, wins the Internet:
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:16pm Cecile:

hey, do you have any Natural Snow Buildings floating around?
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:16pm jeff-m:

sounding fucking yummy
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:17pm Scott Williams:

thanks Jeff-m! Cecile, c'est possible!
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:18pm Dean:

I just learned last night from my 9YO son that "Hotline Bling" is Drake's. Whenever it shows up on the radio, I sing along, but I add as many competing modes of telecommunication as I can imagine: "You used to call me from the payphone [telephone, Morse code, postcard...]." Pisses him off, but only a little. Then there's the Nick Jonas tune, "Chains," which I sing thus: "Trying to bake potatoes but potatoes only bake me!"
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:19pm Dean:

Soul Asylum covered this.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:21pm Scott Williams:

that fucking song bums me out b/c it uses such a great Timmy Thomas sample and just overloads it with dopetude
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:22pm Cecile:

yeah, and not the good kind of dopetude.

I think you should try, "You used to call me from the bathroom", Dean.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:23pm Mdurek:

howdy people
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:23pm Risky:

Wesley on the runaway train
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:24pm 1mckrs:

This train thing is blowing my mind.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:24pm Cecile:

hola, mdurek
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:24pm Scott Williams:

damn, did I just have to dump a "fuck" on this thing?! Heya Mdurek and Risky!
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:24pm 1mckrs:

for the love of heaven, over
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:25pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...Thurston - did you get yer sh&*(& - ?...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:25pm chris:

when you say fuck on the radio in 1948, shit is *real*!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:26pm Cecile:

ITA, chris.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:26pm Mdurek:

hola cecile, que pasa scott y gang
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:26pm Dean:

Funny you should mention the bathroom, Cecile. Aside from the fact that my 4YO daughter, rightly or wrongly, routinely calls me Poo Poo Head, I also learned yesterday how resonant potty humor is with kids. The neighbor twins set up a hot apple cider stand on the corner yesterday and they invited my kids to help them solicit donations to the Humane Society. They were advertising "free" cider, and inviting folks to donate. I suggested they offer "all you can drink" cider, and then charge twenty bucks to use the bathroom. The kids liked the idea, but their mother didn't approve.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:27pm Listener Robert:

It'd be a good test of the "indecency" provision to air a "realities" "fuck" from an actual historic news piece, but not worthwhile jeopardizing WFMU over.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:27pm annie:

Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:27pm Parq:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:27pm Cecile:

Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:28pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

  Mon. 12/21/15 3:28pm brain implant:

  Mon. 12/21/15 3:28pm 1mckrs:

get the hell out of the way, palmer
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:30pm Mdurek:

Meeting Mr. Hambrecht today at 5p to scope out a possible new ZZV spot.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:30pm Cecile:

Also, I forget how much Canadian is in the UP accent.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:31pm Listener Robert:

What's really funny is that while this was on, I was researching (again) as a precursor to "Lost" "The Lost Special" by A.C. Doyle & its previous adaptation, the Solar Pons "Advenrute of the Lost Locomotive" by August Derleth.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:31pm 1mckrs:

are you on here, wesley?
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:31pm Scott Williams:

thanks for the links, @Parq and @RevRab. MDurek, cool!
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:31pm Dean:

There's a video of this runaway train incident, btw: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdT0lJigZ9U
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:32pm Risky:

Wesley.... oh Wesley....
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:32pm 1mckrs:

he's gone then
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:34pm Planet Tyler:

This be creepeee
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:34pm cee:

fascinating recording. where else can one listen in on stuff like this, but WFMU
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:35pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Stoic bunch in 1948.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:35pm 1mckrs:

wes was alone in the engine, yes
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:37pm 1mckrs:

we heard wesley speak up there
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:37pm Cecile:

god, the guy who says "what'd you say LeBeque?" sounds like my father-in-law when he was younger.
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:39pm Roberto:

This is fantastic. It's also smack in the middle of one of my favorite subjects -- North American freight cars of the mid-20th century.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:40pm 1mckrs:

yah, he's walking up the track here now
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:40pm Risky:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:41pm Cecile:

man, these voices bring me home if I don't listen to the words.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:41pm 1mckrs:

Hello, Alfie
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:41pm Scott Williams:

we can laugh NOW
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:41pm annie:

have you all seen the star trek christams carol mash-up?... "shut-up wesley"
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm 1mckrs:

ho, that's some mess, holy all jeepers, i'm telling ya
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm Roberto:

Chuck Yeager's got nothin' on ol' Wesley.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm Andrew:

heard this on fmu years ago still brings tears to my eyes . to hell with the typwriter. yay wesley
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm steve:

  Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm 1mckrs:

send up the hook
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm chris:

holy crap
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm Joe D.:

that was an incredible piece of tape

I'd also like to thank you for not seguing into Soul Asylum
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:42pm Jeff:

Wesley's okay!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:43pm JakeGould:

After hearing that “Runaway Train” transcription… Anway. Yeowch!
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:43pm Nate K:

When I saw "Runaway Train" on the homepage, I thought for a minute you were playing Soul Asylum...and I wanted to know why.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:43pm Listener Robert:

Source I just Googled said this incident occurred in 1987, not 1948.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:43pm sweeks:

That was so awesome
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:43pm 1mckrs:

i got down on the floor, i got down on the floor, the seat buckle got down on top of my head got all busted up
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:47pm steve:

i need a nap or some coffee after that
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:49pm Listener Robert:

Publicity photo of Wes, returned to the scene after being released by hospital:

Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 3:50pm steve:

for a record goin off the rails, ironically
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:51pm V Priceless:

side four of Joe Jackson's double LP "Big World", for future reference!
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:51pm Listener Robert:

He'd done a very smart, albeit somewhat daring, thing by climbing out of the engine & into the next car before the wreck. That acc'ts for the radio silence.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:52pm rw:

One sided vinyl... I'm still confused. You put the needle down on a naked slab of vinyl to see if it skates to one side or the other? I could really use an anti-skating tune-up on my turntable.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:53pm Listener Robert:

That's the smartest survival story I've heard since that of Wagner Dodge's having made himself an escape fire in the Mann Gulch fire, which WAS in 1948 IIRC.
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 3:53pm Roberto:

OK yeah 1987 seems more like it. I was thinking the communications sounded a bit too modern for 1948. Never mind what I said about the mid-century freight cars eh.
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:53pm Dean:

Gosh, it's almost winter. Why would anybody be anti-skating?
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 3:54pm JakeGould:

@NateK: I thought “Runaway Train” might be some Jon Voight reference. Specifically the scene where he loses his shit at the delusional ex-con he’s stuck on the train with. www.youtube.com...
  Mon. 12/21/15 3:56pm Listener Robert:

Wagner Dodge's story has itself been adapted to a piece of recorded music, "Cold Missouri Water".
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:09pm Bas NL:

Great synthi track.. hi Scott!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:12pm Scott Williams:

Hello Bas!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:14pm Uncle Michael:

Runaway Train was more than a "driveway moment," it was "risk immolation by mobile phone at a gas pump" moment.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:21pm Cecile:

the Millers are such a talented and handsome family. Ann Arbor's own!
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:22pm Chris from DC:

Yeah Ben has done some great stuff in his own right.
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:22pm Roberto:

OK -- right date, wrong year. March 9. 1987. www.cwrr.com...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:23pm Cecile:

his and his twin larry's band non-fiction should have done better than they did.
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:24pm Roberto:

The Mets were reigning World Champs!
  Mon. 12/21/15 4:26pm Felipe:

some TAZOS for you scott!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:26pm Scott Williams:

Brother Ben Miller's still at it! even volunteered for a few months at FMU, couple years back before moving back to MI
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:27pm Scott Williams:

thanks for the date corrections on the Runaway Train, y'all. LP had the date as '48
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:27pm Chris from DC:

Last time I was Ben was when he played with Branca down here. He's played in DC quite a bit over the years.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:28pm Cecile:

nice, Scott. As non fiction they did great super-fast Buzzcocks versions of Taking Tiger Mountain by strategy and O Superman.
  Mon. 12/21/15 4:32pm Listener Robert:

"The Lost Special" was inspired by a very different kind of accident that occurred during a similar shunting operation on Sept. 22, 1892 in Lindal, England. In that case the locomotive (Engine 115) fell into a sink hole. Again, only the engr. was aboard, and he recovered fully from his injuries. The TV serial "Lost" was named for & based partly on "The Lost Special", and applied the date (different year, of course) of the loss of Engine 115 to that of the fictional Oceanic Air 815's crash.
  Mon. 12/21/15 4:41pm Listener Robert:

"Watchmen" too was based partly on Doyle's "The Lost Special".
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:43pm steve:

i honestly had no idea anyone cared about Star Wars anymore
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:45pm Uncle Michael:

I guess I'm in the Aristocats demographic.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:46pm Cecile:

oh, steve. You haven't looked at the ThinkGeek website, have you?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 4:46pm Uncle Michael:

Or Jungle Book.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:46pm JakeGould:

“Star Wars: Platoon” by Oliver Stone. The story of a Stormtrooper disillusioned by a war the First Order/Empire cannot win and the Stormtroopers he hangs out with and grows to love.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:48pm Cecile:

When can I say something about Han Solo? I feel like I never will be able to in this spoiler averse environment
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:50pm steve:

i actually have Cecile, i think i put the blinders on to the starwars stuff though
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:50pm Cecile:

actually, "krootchey" is close to how Quebecers say my last name "cloutier"
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:51pm Cecile:

believe me people still care. Deeply.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:52pm JakeGould:

“Star Wars: Apocalypse Now” an elite team of First Order/Imperial Stormtroopers are sent to hunt down a General who has gone AWOL and causing havoc in the Outer Rim. Despite it being in another galaxy, far, far away, somehow old Rolling Stones tracks and “Tears of a Clown” as well as Jim Morrison ramblings will be mixed into the soundtrack.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:52pm steve:

i just assumed after the horrid sequels from the 00s everyone had given up.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:53pm Cecile:

I did not know this Adam Driver person until this film. He has a unique face you don't see in lead actors anymore.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:54pm Cecile:

no steve, a lot of people kept the torch burning. there was better Star Wars on TV cartoons than in movies. Then Lucas let Disney buy him out.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:54pm JakeGould:

@steve: As Scott said in his mic break, this film was designed to push buttons past belief. It is truly the “hot stripper who really likes you” of pop culture movies. Pushing the right buttons, gives you nice visuals, tells you a story just good enough you buy it but then… Not much else.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:55pm steve:

a student actually cornered me after class and made me watch videos of "Sphero", which i understand is star wars related. i told him i had no idea there was a new star wars and he looked really surprised.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:55pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Adam Driver is most non-menacing villain I have ever seen in my life. It was like when the mask came off the pimple faced teen from “The Simpons” was on screen.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:56pm Cecile:

I liked it. I'm looking forward to the sequel. If Empire Strikes back was an opera according to director Irwin Kirschner, then this better be like a dark ballet like Black Swan or Coppelia.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:56pm steve:

haha thats a great analogy Jake
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:56pm Cecile:

My husband referred to the whininess of Anakin's family tree in general.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:56pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: And how about that Mark Hamill? Fantastic acting there.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:56pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

This Star Wars film felt like a "Best of" album.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:57pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...real Space science is just as exciting - see: they've got their shopping cart unstuck... :
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:57pm Cecile:

I thought it was excellent. It didn't take away from the gorgeous scenery.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:57pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

My fellow pointed out that it seems the universe would be fine if not for that one family that keeps fucking things up for everyone else.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:58pm Cecile:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:58pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Notice how George Lucas expanded the universe of Star Wars superficially in the prequels. But as each movie progresses, the actual world of the characters is tons smaller. Everyone is related to everyone. And every coincidence is just perfect. Han Solo just happens to stumble across the Millennium Falcon right at that moment? WHAT A LUCKY GUY!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 4:59pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

Has anyone here ever gotten a photobook printed at Walgreens?
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 4:59pm Cecile:

eh, it's a cheesetacular space serial. I would say the only one that is actually a good "movie" movie is Empire. But I still love it anyway.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:00pm Cecile:

I've had photos - they've done a decent job. I would read their return policy carefully and make sure everything is lined up the way you like it and you should be good.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:01pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

Cecile - thanks! I'm making a book for the boyfriend. I did not think I'd be arranging it so last minute!!!
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:02pm Dean:

Not trolling here, but when I saw the first one in '77 or '78, whenever it came out, I gave up on movies altogether. It was so embarrassingly bad, I thought, but then I reflected that Star Wars isn't that much worse than what passes for good film. I have zero patience for movies.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:02pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Yeah, but to me the first “Star Wars” was good and geared towards kids and adults. But “The Empire Strikes Back” was more in the line of young adult fiction. In neither film did I feel my intelligence was insulted. But in the rest of them—even this one—I feel patronized and the whole religion of “The Force” feels like it is one “strategy meeting with marketing” away from becoming the next Scientology.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:04pm JakeGould:

“Star Wars: Stroszek” The story of one of the Skywalker kids who never made it. Lives on a dessert planet and spends all day at the Cantina. His best friend is a space hooker. They gather enough money to head to a nicer planet but soon find it too is filled with problems, they don’t fit in and it ends with Stroszek Skywalker killing himself in a space amusement park.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:04pm Cecile:

I was done with Lucas when he unveiled the concept of "mitochlorians". Ridiculous. Those movies sucked badly. I stand by the first three, and I liked this one because I think that if the producers start developing their own flavor it could go somewhere. The worldbuilding done by novelists and cartoonists in this universe has been extensive and often quite excellent.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:05pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

I'd see it for free.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:05pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

I was one of those people that grew up in the dead zone between trilogies, and desperately wished for new ones. My geek heart was really shattered by the prequels, so these movies are just like.... hanging out and having fun with the ex who cheated on you.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:05pm Listener Robert:

I saw the 1st then too, & didn't think it bad, though it was far from my favorites. I was like, I get it, you've shown you can make on old serial w modern prod'n values, nice job. But when a sequel was announced, I thought, what's the point in REALLY making it a serial, when the whole gag's been blown? So I was never interested in seeing them.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:06pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

Cecile - That's when I lost it as well. There was something similar in the Timothy Zahn books, where there was an animal that repelled the force. That was such stupid bullshit that I avowed that the Extended Universe stuff meant nothing to me.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:07pm JakeGould:

@(Eyepatch)NoelFox: I hear you. I was 9 years old in 1977 when I saw “Star Wars” in summer camp so my experience will never be like that of others. But I will say you might have your own amazing science fiction film with “The Matrix.” When I saw that in the theater I walked out and was genuinely as blown away as I was when I was a kid and saw “Star Wars” and “The Empire Strikes Back.”
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:08pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

As for the Joseph Campbell deeep Mythology mystical thing - surely there's little to offer here.
As for SciFi - Future Shock is a 24/7 situation now - w/ more Science & Change than one can grapple w/ literally in the palms of our hands.
Action-Adventure is all that's left then...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:08pm Cecile:

Empire Strikes Back is a great movie. I am sad it was a one-shot as Kirschner never directed one again, Leigh Brackett (great early female SF writer) passed soon afterward.

The new SW Rebels series is pretty good, and the Gennedy Tarkowsky Cartoon Netword Sw supershorts toons are excellent - 2-d animation that is stylized and great action.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:09pm JakeGould:

@(Eyepatch)NoelFox: Funny you mention the Timothy Zahn books. Never read them but thanks to this new film been talking to friends and at the end of the day three people are responsible for George Lucas having good ideas: His first wife Marcia Lucas, his producer for the first 2 films Gary Kurtz and Timothy Zahn whose ideas from the novels often were looped back into the best parts of the prequels and “Special Editions.”
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:09pm Cecile:

I thought the Matrix was almost as funny as Black Swan.
Avatar 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 5:09pm Chris from DC:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:10pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: I thought “Black Swan” was a joke. But “The Matrix” I think is as good a cultural touchstone film as “Star Wars” was.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:10pm Cecile:

Jake, my husband is a big Zahn fan. I just like the cartoons.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:11pm JakeGould:

On a positive note I will say this: I really liked how much action Chewbacca got onscreen in “The Force Awakens.” I don’t recall seeing Chewbacca fight so much and do so many cool things before.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:11pm Cecile:

I guess. There are a lot of cultural touchstones I think are pretty dopey. I do use the line "BE THE SPOON" a lot, though.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:11pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...it's all just Cops & Gangs (replacing the antiquated irrelevant Westerns) & Army enrollment drives in Space...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:12pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: I know kung fu!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:12pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...just more Guns & Military, because that's society now...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:12pm Cecile:

ITA. I love Chewy sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much. The Ewoks were supposed to be Wookiees in Return of the Jedi. Can you imagine that movie? I have never forgiven Lucas for that. I want my Wookiee planet, dammit!

hahah, Jake.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:12pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: There is no spoon.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:13pm Cecile:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:13pm Cecile:

Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:14pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

It's literally Disney. How would that have tasted in 1977...
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:14pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

Marcia is definitely someone who doesn't get the credit she deserves.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:16pm Cecile:

yes, fox. Marcia, Irwin Kershner, Lawrence Kasdan, and Steven Spielberg for at least finishing the third movie.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:16pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Gary Kurtz produced the first “Star Wars” and “The Empire Strikes Back” and wanted “Return of the Jedi” to be on the same level/tone as what they established with “The Empire Strikes Back”. Make it hard sci-fi but not too hard but fun… Not childish. George Lucas wanted to slant the films more to kids so he could make essentially children’s films and *cough* sell more crap. So Gary Kurtz was fired and I believe he divorced from Marcia Lucas after or during the production of the film. So hey, there goes your connections to the two things that made the films sane.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:16pm Dean:

I have a deep-seated, but not impenetrable, resistance to SF literature, too. I recall with fondness Asimov's Foundation trilogy and assorted other titles, e.g., Aldiss's Cryptozoic!, and I'd love to read some of them again. But I think I generally read for my own reasons that don't square with why most readers read or writers write. I don't need characters, a narrative, or evocative description, for example, and I'm put off if an author pursues these elements (presumably for their own sake) too virtuosically.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:16pm V Priceless:

love this RC version!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:17pm JakeGould:

@(Eyepatch)NoeFox: Without Marcia Lucas and Gary Kurtz, the first “Star Wars” in 1977 would have been as tone deaf to basic human interaction as the prequels were.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:17pm Cecile:

Exactly, Jake.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:18pm Cecile:

Compare Natalie Portman's performance in a piece of silly, brainless fluff like the Thor movies to the prequels. It's like she's a completely different person. A person who can act.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:19pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

@Jake- Yeah, George Lucas seems like a bit of a robot himself.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:19pm JakeGould:

FWIW, I found this web archive page today while *cough* doing work and it’s an amazingly nice and well thought out overview of Marcia Lucas’ career and not just with “Star Wars.” web.archive.org...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:20pm Cecile:

some people think that he is somewhere on the autistic spectrum.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:20pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Guitarheads are always like - how come no other GuitarPlayer has been deified like Hendrix? Wull - write us a song like this, then...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:20pm Cecile:

Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:21pm (Eyepatch) Noel Fox:

I was really hoping there'd be a scene with R2-D2, where someone was fixing up his underside: "Wow, you've got a lot of carbon scoring under he-*FIRE SHOOTS OUT* Whoah! You've had ROCKETS all this time, R2? Why didn't you mention that?!?!"
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:21pm Dean:

Did Robert Wyatt ever sing with Sun Ra? Would have been nice.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:23pm ?:

@Jake&Cecille: Gary Kurtz's contribution to the tone (and relative intelligence) of the original Star Wars concept can't be overestimated. He really was the co-author of the whole thing. He wasn't fired, he left because (for "Jedi") the elements that made the first one feel somewhat fresh and even unique (at that time) were clearly being sacrificed by George to service the kiddie toy-tie-in market. if he'd stuck around, "Jedi" AND the prequels would have actually pushed the envelope, rather than imploding...
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:24pm P-90:

Woops. That "?" was me
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:24pm JakeGould:

@?: It’s all an inbred universe now. Nobody is not related to an antagonist/protagonist.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:24pm Cecile:

?, I completely agree!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:26pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Lucas donating the massive Disney pay-off is impressive.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:26pm JakeGould:

Also, George Lucas explaining on that same page about Marcia Lucas: “I’m not a good writer. It’s very, very hard for me. I don’t feel I have a natural talent for it… When I sit down I bleed on the page, and it’s just awful.” web.archive.org...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:28pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Some kind of cognitive disorder might explain why someone would not only make the prequels, but would somehow be so obsessed with keeping what is honestly a crappy storyline alive for so many years they would simply stop making any kind of other film. At least Spielberg did other things after “Jaws” and “Raiders of the Lost Ark.”
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:29pm P-90:

George also had a lot of input from Marcia and friends like Coppola and Brian De Palma, who actually wrote most of the final draft of the opening crawl, something they had fiddled with endlessly. So there were a lot of tempering influences before George decided he had to take responsibility for being the sole "genius" of this franchise. That's the source of the distinct difference you can see in in the first two vs. the rest...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:29pm JakeGould:

@RevRabbitNov63: Yes! At least he’s a generous billionaire not like the dot-com dudes and dharma-bros out there nowadays. www.forbes.com...
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:32pm Tommy:

Loved the Canadian National RR broadcast . Was in the car so I couldn't respond at the time
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:35pm P-90:

@Jake re:inbred: Yes, the Vader/Luke Oedipal thing was always part of the plan. (And brilliantly so, imo.) The Leia/sister thing was thrown in at the last minute, and yeah, that was the beginning of forcing the whole story into the mold of "family saga", which was not the original direction.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 5:37pm Andrew Waterloo:

George Lucas is a nerd and the nerdism works well when it comes to the universe, costumes, and set design. The nerdism doesn't work well in story telling which requires a lot more tempering and playing loose with details than most would expect. A lot of sci-fi and anime suffers from the same over attention to detail and over-fascination with process.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:42pm slugluv1313:

excellent show!!!
have been home and listening but not online all day; had to sign in and let you know how wonderful it has been to have you & your show as "company" while slogging through evil mundane household chores -- THANK YOU, Scott!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:43pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Just let the Japanese do all the SciFi.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:43pm Scott Williams:

fascinating deep probe of the star wars stuff, y'all - thank you!
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:43pm JakeGould:

@P-90: The Luke/Leia sibling thing was done at the last minute when George Lucas did not think he had the time, energy or concern to make all 9 movies. So instead of leaving the romance issue hanging in mid-air he said, "Screw it! It's over! No romance! They are reunited siblings who are working together with the aid of teddy bears to kill their father! Let's go home and work on Howard the Duck!"
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:44pm Scott Williams:

Danke, @slugluv1313! always happy to accompany the housework
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:45pm JakeGould:

@ScottWilliams: You're welcome! At least the new film made me remember all of the specifics behind how a functionally illiterate film student was able to capture the hearts and minds of a whole generation!
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:47pm steve:

the guy from Lost Treasures generously gave me a free copy of this LP at Monty Hall. i dig it.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:47pm slugluv1313:

ahhh your show makes the housework somewhat bearable!
and what Tommy said about the Canadian National RR broadcast, FASCINATING!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:48pm Cecile:

No, Jake, I always thought Han and Leia had way more chemistry. That part they got right. The sister part, well, they could have done that better. If at all.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:52pm JakeGould:

FWIW, I have been reading the HUGE coffee table book on "The Empire Strikes Back" and it is fascinating to read how much Irvin Kershner would read the script and constantly ask questions about motivations and actions. Without him the whole Han Solo carbonite scene would have been an afterthought. He is the one who devised subtle motivations for each character. Including making Lando be remorseful for his actions. He filmed it as an execution scene which George Lucas never thought of it being.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:53pm MenfussMike:

this is haunting. what do you know about Ms. Foster?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 5:53pm Andrew Waterloo:

It seemed like the sister thing was thrown in to make Luke more sacrificial to Darth Vader.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:53pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:53pm Cecile:

I have nothing but love for Irwin Kerschner.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:55pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...'just trying to drive the f'r out'...
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:55pm slugluv1313:

yes, more on Ms. Foster! her voice/demeanor reminds me a bit of Karen Dalton
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:55pm JakeGould:

@Cecile: Han and Leia had more chemistry. But they were always playing a competitive romance between Han, Luke and Leia. In the end, Han and Leia would still be a couple but Luke would have just disappeared to become essentially a monk. A thread they seem to have picked up for this new film. But I just don't like J.J. Abrams avoidance of subtle human interaction and desire to just push buttons and pander.
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:56pm Scott Williams:

great time today everyone, thanks for hanging and edumacating! have a wonderful holidayze & I'll see you next week
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:56pm Cecile:

Abrams isn't subtle, but there are still a few killer emotional scenes in there.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:57pm JakeGould:

@AndrewWaterloo: True. But the whole plot line of the films is simple and fluid. But the ultimate reason the sibling aspect happened was to cleanly end the trilogy.
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:57pm Cecile:

likewise, scott!

Everyone drink a toast to Marcia Lucas this week if they're so inclined.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:57pm P-90:

@Jake Actually, if you look at "Empire", it's clear right from the beginning who the romance is between, and that some suspense about Luke and Han competing for Leia's affection is not a part of the story. Lucas turned to the sister thing later in desperation for a motivation for Luke to "lose it" and attack Vader in rage, per the Emperor's intention.
And yes, those subtleties in "Empire that expand the wuole thing so nicely, but organically from where the 1st film started, that was all Kurtz working with Kersch. and Lucas thought they were wasting time and money.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:58pm JakeGould:

Thanks Scott for letting us type this stuff and appreciating it!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 5:58pm Cecile:

exactly, P-90
Avatar Swag For Life Member Mon. 12/21/15 5:59pm Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Thx SW.
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:59pm JakeGould:

@P-90: They were wasting time and money. You can't sell teddy bears with romance outside of Valentine's Day!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 🎃 Mon. 12/21/15 5:59pm Bas NL:

Thanks Scott!
  Mon. 12/21/15 5:59pm P-90:

Danke Scott, Merry Christmas and all that Jazz!
Avatar Mon. 12/21/15 6:00pm MenfussMike:

i agree slugluv1313. KD was exactly what i was thinking of
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